Its no secret that I'm not a big a fan of John Calvin or anything theology connected to him. But I've been thinking...
Would people be more accepting of Calvinistic/Reformed theology if it was taught in light of these past 3 posts? If hyper-Calvinism, Calvinism, and neo-Calvinism was connected to annihilationism, would people still hold such a strong distaste for it? If it wasn't taught that God was literally choosing to send billions of people to "eternal torment," would people believing the "free will side of things" be more open to the discussion with those on the other side of the theological spectrum?
I'm curious as to what you all think.
Thursday, January 29, 2009
At least he has a cool beard...
Posted by JD at 10:52 AM
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8 comments:
Not necessarily, and here's why:
I think the argument it more of an atonement issue than it is about sinners hiking brimstone mountains for eternity.
It still bears the question... "Where's the love?"
And that's what the fuss is all about. LOVE.
I think one of the big reasons that people don't like Calvinism is because they don't want to think that non-Christians are going to eternally suffer at the hands of God. They also don't want to think that God pre-ordained this suffering to happen. So I think you're right on the money: If you tone down the punishment God ordained, then they will be more likely to accept that he did ordain it. Gen. 50:20-"As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good.." I don't think too many people have a qualm with God having Joseph put into slavery in order to save Israel from faminine. I think its God putting people into "eternal torment" that people have a problem with. In other words, its not God preordaining, but what it is that he preordains.
I won't get into the whole calvinism anti-calvinism and anywhere in between debate, but I think that people who have a problem with God choosing a person or not choosing a person will offend people regardless of whether the non-elect are tormented forever or simply destroyed. I think the main reason people object is that they feel that, regardless of the punishment, those people didn't choose their end.
If i told someone they had no choice in the matter and that God sends some to heaven and the rest to hell I imagine they would be hard pressed to follow such a movment.
Now if I told them that there was a loving God who wanted to save them and spend eternity with them and that all they had to do was accept this gift and live accordingly, then I imagine I could get a lot more on board with me. I'd be interested in seeing the statistics....
a simple question: How much has anyone following this post, or the author, actually read of Calvin?
Jeremiah has probably read much more than I have. I've never read a full volume of any of his writings--just excerpts and biographical information on him.
I don't have a problem so much with John Calvin (seeing as he's dead) as I do with the theology and school of thought associated with his name. Regardless of how many people he had burned at the stake, I never got a chance to talk it out with him, so I have no personal problems with the man himself. I just think Reformed theology spits in the face of everything God is.
I, however, am willing to admit my tendency to ere. I am human and prone to mistakes. So I could have God all wrong. But deep down in my core, I know God is love. I know there is no fear in perfect love. I know that in a loving relationship, there is always a way out.
But anyway, I'm rambling...
To CD: what does your question have to do with my post? I didn't question Calvin or even Calvinistic/Reformed theology in my post or in my post's question. So what does your question have to do with the discussion at hand?
I only asked if people would be more accepting of Reformed thought if it was taught in light of some of the ideas of my past three posts.
Reformed theology pisses me off just as much as the next guy but whatever, my main thing is this, fuck him for burning people.
Right on, Stefan. Lol...
Bringing it on home, my friend.
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