Tuesday, March 18, 2008

Pardon my ignorance...

I hadn't taken the time to read up on John McCain's stances on some issues. I assumed he was pro-life simply because he is a hard-line conservative.

He is not.

McCain is pro-choice. His voting record backs it up, too. He wants to overturn Roe v Wade, ban partial-birth abortions, and put a bunch of limitations on abortions, but he still supports a woman's right to choose. Read about him here.

I'm curious about those of you who have told me you can't vote for Obama or Clinton simply because they are pro-choice... if the Republican nominee is pro-choice as well, and would probably keep the country on the same terrible course its on now, who do you plan on voting for???


Anonymous said...

That's a major concern that I have. McCain has committed publicly numerous times to appointing morally conservative justices though. That's the best hope for over one and a half million lives in forthcoming years.

Obama and Clinton have repeatedly promised they will only appoint justices committed to maintaining the right to "unlimited abortions".

Saintdoc said...

Voted NO on criminal penalty for harming unborn fetus during other crime. (Mar 2004)
Voted NO on banning partial birth abortions except for maternal life. (Mar 2003)-Clinton

Both Obama and Clinton Rated 100% by NARAL, indicating a pro-choice voting record. McCain however was Rated 0% by NARAL, indicating a pro-life voting record. This information came from the link you provided in your post.

McCain is clearly the Pro-life canidate.

JD said...

That's great that the NARAL rated him 0%. But the NRLC rated him 75% (saying he has a mixed record on abortion).

As recently as 1999 he was saying that he would not overturn Roe v Wade. I think its all political pandering. He wants to win the presidential race and was seen as being far too liberal of a Right-winger by most of the country. I don't think you can take a rating by one group and call him pro-life. Keep in mind, he doesn't want to change anything on his own. He said HE WOULD NOT repeal Roe v Wade. McCain said that the Supreme Court should decide. Once again, he doesn't want to outlaw abortion, he has clearly said there should be exceptions to keep abortions legal.

I just think its funny that people insist on calling him pro-life so they feel better about voting for him instead of a Democrat. When Josh accused my logic stemming from me "not wanting to be aligned with the religious right," I laughed. Because I would in turn say the opposite (but really the same) thing to so many people saying they have to vote Republican. I feel like they're doing so because they feel like they just can't vote Democratic.

Who a candidate is on paper means everything. They way they've voted is the way they will continue to vote. I just don't see McCain being a catalyst for change. I just don't see a better society coming from his presidency. I don't see 1.5 million lives suddenly popping back up on the radar, for that matter. Call him pro-life, call him pro-choice, I don't care. I will continue to refuse to elect a candidate based on one campaign platform (though I clearly don't support abortion). But does anyone really think that there is one optimal candidate in this race?

McCain's voting record http://www.ontheissues.

McCain on abortion

McCain in his own words

Subvert the empire, worship the baby.

Tim said...

It's fundamentalism JD. The same thought process behind the idea of our nation's problems being a result of Kennedy and Clinton's administrations. I voted for GW...twice, but I'm a free thinker and I'm willing to learn from my mistakes, and do my part to make things, everything, better. I'd be interested to see the abortion rates comparing times of liberal and conservative presidents. Also, I'd like to know how many justices will need to be appointed over the next 5 years?

The optimal candidate is Barrack- Hillary-Al-Edwards, he is pro-life.

Tim said...

Side note: There are 7 current Supreme Court justices appointed by conservative (republican) presidents. If all you can hang your hat on is that your president will possibly get the opportunity to appoint a justice that more than likely will not find abortion unconstitutional, as has happened for the last 30 years, I'm scared that votes will be cast in such a way. At least tell me there are other things about McCain that you guys support, not just an ambiguous pro-life stance.
On Wikipedia, under abortions in the US, you can see that during a time of economic success abortion rates declined dramatically. The more interesting note is that a liberal president was in office at the time. Now, as a pro-life supporter, I'd be more interested in facts like these, and support a culture that would not want or need abortion, than pipe dreams of Roe v Wade being overturned. The thought that abortions would stop if it was overturned is pretty unrealistic. Marijuana is illegal; I can have some in 30 minutes and get it from a high school student who is not even old enough to drive.

BfH said...

Tim, would it be OK with you if I followed you around waving a flag sometime?

(not being a smartass at all)

Tim said...

Heck no! I don't need a bullseye on my back.

BfH said...

...fair enough...haha

Jeremiah said...

Aside from that one statement I don't see where John McCain is supposed to be pro-choice. The unwillingness to repeal Roe v. Wade doesn't immediately indicate a pro-choice status.

JD said...

I guess my point isn't that he is pro-life or pro-choice... my point is that saying he is pro-life is deceiving when you consider his political career and voting record.

Call him what you will, I think he is playing the media--trying to appear both "conservative" and "liberal" in order to garner more support. He's being a smart politician, sure, I just don't know what to think of it.

jason said...

jd -

I'm not sure where you got the 75% for McCain, but the NRLC seems to support McCain.

"National Right to Life is also grateful for the strong pro-life voting record on abortion of Senator John McCain, and appreciates the pro-life position he has taken in his Senate campaigns and in this presidential campaign." ( and (

He opposes Roe v. Wade but says that he would let the states decide; opposes partial birth abortion; and supports parental notification. While his position on Roe v. Wade is certainly not the hard-line taken by the hard right conservatives, I think it still qualitifies him for "pro-life".